Here is my controversial take: if it is true that a cat needs to be let outdoors unsupervised in order to live a happy life full of enrichment, then we should not have pet cats at all.
TW: Discussions of animal death.
Letting a cat wander outside unsupervised is cruel both to local wildlife, but also cruel to the cat.
Letting cats outside is often introducing a non-native species to an ecosystem which has not evolved to deal with cats. How is it any different to us accidentally introducing invasive rats, weasels, and other small predatory mammals into ecosystems? We invest a lot of money into ridding sensitive ecosystems of these invasive species but we turn a blind eye to cats because we selfishly benefit from them being around us, whether it’s because we find them cute or because they provide a practical use for us as mousers.
I’m fed up of my neighbours cats who visit my garden. They poop in my planters where I grow vegetables that I eat, which presents a serious health risk to me. The cats predate the birds who visit my garden, which has exclusively been successful on fledglings and other young birds. So far, it has not been a species that is vulnerable and it’s only common garden birds, but cats will kill indiscriminately and I have heard many horror stories of endangered birds being predated by cats owned by friends-of-friends.
A pigeon couple has been building a nest in a tree in my garden, but this morning I saw it was predated. I found a chewed open egg, and when showing a photo to my ornithologist friend she theorizes it was most likely a cat as the puncture into the egg shell will have been cleaner if it had been a predatory bird. Predation is a natural part of life, but this predation was not by a natural predator which is part of our local ecosystem and thus I am very upset…
But not only that, I believe letting a cat go outdoors unsupervised is cruel to the cat. Cats so often go missing, more often than not killed by cars. In other countries there are dangerous animals who can kill cats. This is not an issue here but I have personally had to dispose of dead cats who turn up in my garden after being run over on the road in front of my house. I don’t think there is any other common pet animal where we so easily expose them to dangers we cannot protect them from.
Just to say, I do not hate cats. I do not blame the cats for pooping in my vegetable beds, or hunting on my property. They are animals only doing what their instincts dictate, and often are doing what we ourselves have taught them when we first domesticated them. Equally, to a degree I struggle to blame some cat owners as people will often argue that keeping a cat inside is cruel, and they do not desire to be cruel to their cats. The intentions are good, and education on this matter is poor.
There is an issue here which needs to be discussed, and the hypocracies we have normalized need to be challenged. For me, I feel that cats either need to be kept indoors if we can verify that this is not cruel to the cat, or we should be required to supervise our cats outdoors like we are supposed to do with dogs, or we should stop having pet cats. Having unsupervised outdoor cats is unacceptable.
Edit: Grammar and adding a TW just to be safe!
I know not everyone will be able to, but I had an outside enclosure built for my kitty that connects to my house. He gets to sunbathe out there, stare at wild animals, hide in his special bush. He loves it. He gets to enjoy the outdoors without harming the wildlife or putting himself in danger.
That actually sounds like an awesome idea.
deleted by creator
It’s a rant, I’ll add on with one of my own.
I absolutely, really, hate that this gets spun around as “keeping a cat inside is cruel” or “my kitty is innocent” or whatever.
“Don’t let your cats outside because it’s dangerous for them!!”. No, it’s really not. The cat IS the danger. The hedgehogs, the birds, the polecats, all other small to medium mammals are terrorized by your cat. The actual medium sized predators are forced out of their territories, because they actually have to live on the food they catch, and don’t just hunt for fun.
I really don’t care if it’s cruel to the cat if it’s kept from killing hundreds of animals over the course of its life. But it’s always about the “cute little uwu kitties”.
And the idea of a neighborhood cat is somehow normalized. It’s normal to see a cat on the street for some reason. They’re “cute”, and every neighborhood has at least one. Awesome.
You might think I’m irrationally angry about this. But the fact is, that cats kill billions of birds [1] in the U.S yearly. Do you know how much a billion is? It’s almost unimaginable.
But it’s somehow normal. And I come across as a cat hater when I mention this to people who let their cats outside.
I wish I could like cats, and I did use to. But now, they’re just a symbol of death for me.
[1] https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms2380 (I’m aware that ~70% are caused by un-owned cats, but how many cat ladies supporting them are in your neighborhood?)
Looking at the comments I’m so happy Beehaw has an overall good take on this subject. With progressive mindsets it seems 50/50 whether they agree with protecting cats and the environment. There is so much science that shows having cats be outdoors not only decimates local fauna but also increases mortality of the cat up to ~80% (over the years I’ve seen studies on that subject ranging from 67% to 85%). Keep your cat inside if you care about it, if it’s bored you’re not playing with it enough or don’t have a good environment for it to explore and keep entertained. Pay attention to your cats.
I was walking my dog earlier this week and came across a cat that had most likely been killed by a coyote. It was incredibly upsetting to see and completely ruined my day. That cat did not need to live it’s last moments in fear and fighting for its life, if only it’s owners had kept it inside/supervised it when outside.
On a better note. I once saw a woman walking down the street and her cat was just following her along (no leash). It was super cute and you could definitely tell they had a fantastic bond. More cat owners should be like that lady.
Some people unfortunately don’t want to deny their pets anything, even if it’s for their own good. I knew a woman who fed her dog chocolate ice cream because it was “too sad” to deny the dog or give it species-appropriate treats. Or people feeding ducks bread even though they know it’s a bad idea just because doing it makes them feel good.
So, even if letting a cat free roam outside is bad for the cat, the neighbours, and the environment, and the owner knows that, letting their cat loose makes them feel better so outdoors they go.
I don’t believe it’s cruel for cats to be indoors, people just don’t play with their cats enough or provide them enough enrichment.
With some of the cats I’ve interacted with, letting them outside would probably be cruel itself. One is scared of the weirdest things, like string, and complete fails at even hunting bugs in the house. Not to mention the crazy heat waves we’ve been having that would definitely be a problem for an indoor cat with thick fur.
Lol my cat runs and hides at the sound of lawn mowers in an almost ptsd like furor.
She’d never make it outside
I’ve heard that putting a bell and a bright, reflective collar on a cat can prevent them from hunting wildlife.
Does anyone know how true this is, or if doing so would negate some of the risks of having an outdoor cat?There’s also this: https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pet-advice/does-putting-a-bell-on-your-cats-collar-stop-them-from-hunting.html
Will a collar bell warn prey in time for them to get away? … When it comes to birds, cats are usually far less successful at catching them than they are with rodents. Exceptions to this are baby birds and fledglings that are unable to get away, for which a bell wouldn’t help.
This reminded me of an experience I had personally. TW: Animal Death
I had a very young Starling, it had only fledged the nest within the last day or two, soaking in a bird bath I had in my garden. A cat pounced out from behind one of my bushes and frightened it into taking flight. But it’s feathers were too heavy with water and it did not have the strength to surmount the fence of my garden and crashed into it. The cat promptly pounced on it. A bell or a reflective collar would certainly not have helped in this situation.
It also would not have helped with the anecdote from my original post regarding the pigeon eggs which were eaten by a cat this morning in my garden…
I’ve done a bit of reading on this and here’s some reading I’ve found:
From: https://kb.rspca.org.au/knowledge-base/how-can-i-reduce-or-prevent-my-cat-from-hunting-prey/
The only effective way to completely prevent your cat from hunting prey is to keep them safely contained at home.
Research has found that bells on collars are relatively ineffective [2] but other research has shown that some specially designed cat predation devices may reduce predation [3, 4].
From: https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/general-science/should-i-attach-bell-my-cats-collar
A number of studies have looked at whether or not bells help prey escape from cats [1] [2], and the general consensus is yes! Bells on collars seem to reduce the amount of prey caught by about half, which could be enough to no longer pose a threat to ecosystems.
Some owners worry that as well as alerting prey, a bell would also alert large predators to a cat’s presence. While this is possible, given most predator’s acute hearing, it’s unlikely that the relatively quiet noise of a bell would make the difference between your cat getting detected or not. If you live in an area where your cat is at risk of being attacked by large animals you should probably be keeping your cat indoors anyway, or at least supervise their outdoor activities.
TL;DR Bells and bright reflective collars at best reduce the success of cats when hunting but it certainly does not completely prevent them from being successful when hunting. However it may put them at greater risk of danger from large predators and if your cat is at risk of being attacked by large animals then it should be kept indoors or supervised.
Thought on it is split. This article has some decent citations on for and against as well as ways to keep an indoor cat more than happy:
https://www.toe-beans.com/blogs/pet-blog/case-for-against-bells
My personal experience with years of pet sitting and just being familiar with many different cat personalities is that it can help, but it can also be adapted around and does nothing for the other major risks of being outdoors. They will still try to hunt wildlife. A baby bird, for example, probably won’t get to observe the significance of a cat bell before meeting one in a close encounter.
I agree. I live in a rural area in a country where cats were seen as farm tools rather than living beings and pets until very recently, and keeping a cat indoors is believed to be “cruel” by most, but I see cats killed by cars incredibly frequently.
Also, I have two highly prey-driven dogs who are always controlled except when they’re in my walled back garden. The neighbour’s outdoor cat wandered into my garden, and it ended in a tragedy that left both me and the neighbour traumatised. The cat didn’t survive. It was in no way my fault, or even really the dogs’ fault- the cat should never have been allowed to wander into the dogs’ space on my property.
Then the neighbour tried to have our dogs put down, claiming that the dogs had come into her garden, killed the cat, and returned to our garden. Thankfully the dog warden who came to investigate saw that this was patent nonsense- we have a double-gated 3-metre wall with wire across the top on the neighbour’s side, it’s not possible for the dogs to escape into the next garden and quickly return.
So the neighbour built a catio for her new cat and does not let it wander. I am deeply sorry that a cat died before she came to that conclusion, but she should have controlled her animal just as I control mine.
That is such an awful experience. I also have a dog with a pretty strong prey drive. Every once in a while a neighbor’s cat will crawl along the top of our fence and he goes nuts. If he ever caught the cat, I’m sure it would be the end of it. I would feel so guilty because the cat doesn’t deserve that, but what else can I do? I have a strong fence around my yard and my dog is never off leash anywhere else. We’ve trained him well enough that he’s totally chill with our own indoor cat, but outside cats are a completely different story.
Letting your pet roam around wouldn’t be acceptable if it were a dog, why is a cat okay?
I’m glad your dog is ok and the neighbor seemed to learn their lesson. Too bad it had to happen like that. When OP said “in other countries” dangerous animals attack cats I immediately thought of dogs as a threat to cats anywhere. We are in the US in an urban area and there are also owls, hawks, tics, poisonous snake, all which pose a potential threat to outdoor cats.
Yes honestly I had forgotten of the danger that dogs on private property will pose to cats, as this is certainly an issue in my country and is probably a near universal danger to cats across the world. I’ve not heard of anyone who has had their dog kill a cat, or had a cat killed by a dog, but it will have certainly happened somewhere in my local neighbourhood.
I’m the person who posted above about her dogs killing a cat that came into our garden. It would have been my preference that my dogs were acclimatised to cats rather than seeing them as prey, but that would pretty much require that I had owned a cat when they were young dogs, and I didn’t. They honestly react the exact same way to a cat that they would to a hare or a badger, but I’m sure the hare would be faster than them and the badger would fight back.
Absolutely agree. Keeping cats indoor, or only letting them outside with a leash or fenced off area, is the responsible thing to do. People in general just dont nearly care about animals even a tenth as much as they often proclaim to do. They have no issue with them being killed for their own selfish reasons. If you agree you should do what my username says lol.
Using animals for food is not inherently shameful; humans have done this for thousands of years. The difference is, humans used to respect the animals as more than just a food source and utilize as much of a killed animal as possible. The problem nowadays is the sheer excess. Corporate-owned farms are disgusting and the conditions are utterly cruel all in the name of profit and supplying demand.
Nah, I’ll go lab/vat-grown.
I love birds. I have a couple myself but I also put considerable time and effort into making my garden a place for them to visit. I’m sure you know where this is going.
I hate that there’s nothing I can do to keep cats out of the yard. I hate that people are too lazy to provide enrichment for their pet indoors and feel entitled to inflict it upon the neighborhood instead. I have had to clean up dead kittens who got hit and crawled under my car to die. I have had to clean up full dead families of birds I rarely get to see anymore who I somehow lucked into enticing them to nest nearby. I have found full nests of dead newborn rabbits with my lawn mower because they had been left scattered dead in tall grass and already teeming with maggots in the summer sun.
I don’t understand why all of this has to be my problem. There is quite simply nothing good about letting cats outdoors. If they’re not fixed, they create kittens who end up dead. If someone tries to control their hunting with a bell on the collar, they just adapt and go on killing. They shit and fight and die miserable deaths, and for what? Why are people so stubborn and just straight up mean when it comes to keeping your pet indoors? You can show someone the statistics and point them to resources for indoor enrichment and they get mad about it. I don’t get it.
Over the decades, my mother has fostered approximately 20 or so cats born in the neighborhood outside to strays. She will either bring them to the AWA or a no-kill shelter for adoption, find them a home personally, or adopt them into the household. To this day, all the cats my parents have owned were brought in from the wild and socialized.
Ignorant owners are solely the cause of decades of time and money invested in that endeavor. Their house is near a major state route and there are a shit ton of drop-offs. And the worst part is, nobody else in the neighborhood gives a fuck. It has been only through the efforts of my mother that the cat population has been kept in control in the neighborhood where I grew up.I have 2 cats… They live inside and seem happy to me. My sister used to let her cats out and was calling my boyfriend near daily to come deal with some small animal they had killed. One day it was a bunny. We have 3 pet bunnies, also indoors, also seemingly happy. That frickin upset him so much so that was the end of it. I told her he couldn’t clean up any more dead animals for her and she would need to keep them inside or handle it herself. She has had them indoors now for over a year and it was a tough transition but they seem fine now.
Yeah, I really cannot stress enough just how upsetting it is to clean up dead kittens. All the dead baby animals are upsetting but it hits different when it’s a kitten.
I love cats, but the fact that they ruin local wildlife has been known for quite some time.
From the American Bird Conservancy:
Outdoor domestic cats are a recognized threat to global biodiversity. Cats have contributed to the extinction of 63 species of birds, mammals, and reptiles in the wild and continue to adversely impact a wide variety of other species, including those at risk of extinction, such as Piping Plover.
The ecological dangers are so critical that the International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN) lists domestic cats as one of the world’s worst non-native invasive species.
So, I agree with you on this point alone. I mean, your other points are good, too, but I think the impact to wildlife is the strongest and best argument against outdoor cats. I’m definitely not in favor of not having pet cats. My life would be so incomplete…
I love feeding and watching the local wild birds, and I love my cats. So I keep my cats inside. Simple.
Right, I don’t know how this is up for debate. It’s seriously for the cat’s own good, and in the best interest of the local ecosystem.
I live in a city so the only local wildlife is rats and pigeons. I dont have a cat and i wouldn’t worry if my cat killed either.
Because that the cats already killed the other wildlife?
I’d also argue that having a cat inside all the time is equally as cruel to the cat. Having pets most of the time isn’t a benefit to the animal but instead to the human. Dogs included. Overall it’s cruel to animals to keep them as pets and a lot of people who intensely care for animals don’t want to hear that. They want to fill their house with as many pets as possible and they don’t understand that’s not healthy for anyone.
What’s cruel is having a pet you never interact with or care for. Inflicting your cat on your neighborhood is just a different kind of cruelty altogether - as is dropping your domesticated animal into a dangerous environment unsupervised. It’s not a zero sum game where the cat is either indoors and tortured or outdoors and fulfilled. You can provide more than adequate enrichment with a modest investment of time and money. Insisting on the misery of your cat to persist is ironically the true projection of human emotion here.
Honest question to anyone who disagrees: many small animals are kept inside their entire lives. Is this torture? Do you look down on those who own small animals?
many small animals are kept inside their entire lives. Is this torture?
I’d say the small animal isn’t as happy as it could be. That it’s likely not a great life. Torture goes too far but I would say it’s likely not fulfilled and that the small animal would want to go outside if it understood it from birth. domesticating animals so much that we’ve changed their evolution is probably a bad thing.
Do you look down on those who own small animals?
I don’t. It’s very human to own animals. I can understand why people do it and I don’t look down on them because I have a different opinion than them. I just don’t see that perpetuating the evolutionary path of domestication is a good thing.
If it’s a rescue, it’s much more humane than just killing it or letting it run free tho. My indoor cat that I found as a struggling stray on the street is plenty happy and has no wantingness to go outdoors.
Having pets most of the time isn’t a benefit to the animal but instead to the human.
My cats would have either gone hungry or been killed by dogs had I not adopted them. My parents’ cat would be behind bars or euthanized had she not been adopted.
Here is my controversial take: if it is true that a cat needs to be let outdoors unsupervised in order to live a happy life full of enrichment, then we should not have pet cats at all.
So, what do you propose to do with all the cats that currently exist? Abandon them to fend for themselves? That would result in them being…outdoors, exactly like what you’re complaining about. Kill them all? That’s cruel, too. And unlike wild animals, cats trust us as their protectors and caretakers, so killing them would also be a betrayal.
It’s way too late to make the argument you’re making. All that can be done at this point is to sterilize them all, which is already in progress.
The proposal being made is to keep your pet cat(s) indoors. That’s it.
That’s cruel, as has already been mentioned.
It is not, as has also already been mentioned.
The offered justification for that claim is preposterous. The same reasoning could be used to justify locking children in the house 24/7 as well, and I certainly hope you agree that that would be unquestionably cruel.
You can’t compare animals and humans, though. I know we love our pets like children but that’s just not how this works. A lot of work has been put into the behavioral science of enriching an indoor cat’s environment but for some reason it gets entirely disregarded when it comes to the idea that your cat doesn’t belong outside.
You can’t compare animals and humans, though.
I can, just did, and will continue to do so. Humans aren’t magical.
A lot of work has been put into the behavioral science of enriching an indoor cat’s environment but for some reason it gets entirely disregarded when it comes to the idea that your cat doesn’t belong outside.
Even more work has been put into entertaining humans at home, and it’s still considered a poor substitute for outdoor activities.
It isn’t. Two cats, both happily exist inside and have no need or want to go outside.
Good for those two cats, but some other cats disagree sharply with them.
We keep all our current cats indoors and stop breeding domestic cats…
We keep all our current cats indoors
That’s cruel, as you yourself have already mentioned.
stop breeding domestic cats…
Since when were people intentionally breeding domestic cats?
That’s cruel, as you yourself have already mentioned.
I do not personally believe that it is. But let’s say that it is… if keeping cats indoors is cruel and keeping cats outdoors is cruel then I think we have no other option but to try and pick the lesser evil? I believe keeping cats indoors would be the lesser evil, but of course I’d believe that since I don’t think keeping cats indoors is cruel in the first place…
Since when were people intentionally breeding domestic cats?
… at catteries?
But let’s say that it is… if keeping cats indoors is cruel and keeping cats outdoors is cruel
Letting cats outdoors is risky, not cruel. Not the same thing.
then I think we have no other option but to try and pick the lesser evil?
Indeed. Letting them out appears to be the lesser evil, as it involves a mere chance of the cat suffering, instead of a complete certainty.
… at catteries?
I see. Well, that needs to be illegal yesterday.
Letting cats outdoors is risky, not cruel. Not the same thing.
I personally would not be comfortable subjecting any animal under my care to risks that I could prevent. But again, this argument comes from my belief that keeping cats indoors is not cruel… but if keeping cats indoors is in fact cruel then I wouldn’t want to have a pet cat at all in the first place. I would not be comfortable subjecting it to the risks that letting it roam outside unsupervised brought. Which I suppose is the point of my original post: if the only option to allow cats to roam around unsupervised then I believe we should not own cats at all.
Indeed. Letting them out appears to be the lesser evil, as it involves a mere chance of the cat suffering, instead of a complete certainty.
There’s a couple of factors to consider when weighing up the lesser evil in this hypothetical situation beyond the cats wellbeing, such as the impact on the local native wildlife. But this could start going into a wildly different argument because I would argue above all as an environmentalist that causing as little damage to nature as possible is of utmost importance. Can we calculate the risk of causing serious irreversible damage to local ecosystems by letting all domestic cats roam outdoors at once?
So, basically, the choice is between lettings cats suffer in the short term or letting prey animals suffer in the short term (and possibly the environment as a whole long term)? Honestly… this is not a question I feel comfortable answering, personally, because I do not want to support the idea of anything suffering.
I personally would not be comfortable subjecting any animal under my care to risks that I could prevent.
That’s basically helicopter parenting for cats. Yeah, they’ll be safe, but they also won’t live fulfilling lives.
I would argue above all as an environmentalist that causing as little damage to nature as possible is of utmost importance.
I do not want to support the idea of anything suffering.
As long as you still live, that’s exactly what you’re doing: causing suffering. There is no way for the existence of humans, or life forms in general, to be completely harmless. All life is harmful to other life, by competing over scarce resources if not outright predation. There is no escape; the universe strictly forbids true harmony among the living.
That is the sad conclusion I came to after many years struggling with ideas like yours. That’s why I’ve given up on them. My only hope now is that the afterlife, if it exists, is better. In the mean time, the best I can do is to minimize the amount of life I create, meaning no having children, no breeding pets, and no creating artificial intelligence.
Cat breeders are a successful business. But they’re not the people who care about cat or other animal wellbeing.
I see. Well, that needs to be illegal yesterday.
I’m not sure what to add here that hasn’t already been said, so I’m just going to vent.
Cats in urban areas are vermin. In rural areas, they’re pests. They’re disgusting unclean animals, a vector for disease, and I hate them. I also live with an indoor cat. She’s pretty polite most of the time, and we get along just fine. I would not choose to have a cat, but my partner owns a cat, and they’re a package deal.
Outdoor cats should not be a thing.
There is an outdoor cat living across the street from me, and he’s by far one of the friendliest cats I’ve ever met. As soon as he meets you, you can pick him up, touch his belly, he doesn’t care. He also runs right out in front of cars and kills local birds. I’ve saved more than one bird from him. He’s a very charming little asshole, but he shouldn’t be outdoors.
In Australia, they’re paying people to hunt feral cats. There is footage on YouTube. I used to think cats didn’t belong cooped up in the house, but now I see that they belong exclusively cooped in the house. I hope we’ve reached a tipping point regarding awareness on this issue.
End rant.
The problem from my point of view is people not spaying/neutering cats, and then inevitably a feral population will show up. Many cats can have a litter at 6 months old. I’ve personally watched generations of cats grow outside my workplace.
It’s a huge problem. All the local shelters are beyond max capacity JUST FROM CATS. Feral cats explode in population, and the only real way to get populations under control is more Trap-Neuter-Return programs along with educating cat owners on why they absolutely must spay/neuter. There is no excuse not to.
