Still better than the official reddit app.
Smoke signals would be better than the official app.
I’ve considered switching to carrier pigeons
I know some pensioners in my neighbourhood that’d love to talk to you about that.
All you need are two tin cans joined by string.
Do I have the proposal for you! RFC2549
Just not using the app is better than using the app.
I can’t fathom how they bought a good app, put a dev “team” on it for 7 years, and still don’t have half the features some neckbeards in their mom’s basements without access to the backeng still managed to put into their apps.
What a pack of incompetent fucks.
A surprisingly low bar
So true.
The big user experience problem is everyone is getting funneled into Lemmy.world and Lemmy.ml, and they can’t scare fast enough.
But Lemmy is federated. So signup for a smaller instance. You’ll still be able to subscribe and post to communities on other instances.
Ha, I applied to two smaller instances and have heard nothing but radio silence. The smaller instances are of no help if they don’t let anyone in.
Use and recommend lemm.ee, lemmy.one, and vlemmy.net to others
Seriously, stop recommending large servers when lemmy hasn’t been optimized for that yet. The point of decentralization is spreading out and still being connected; let’s not waste that advantage.
I run https://thelemmy.club - people are always welcome here :)
Ok, but what if the instance I choose just ends suddenly? Do I understand it correctly that on each one I have to create a new account and re-subscribe to all the communities etc,?
well this just happened with vlemmy.net, i was affected by this and had to manually resubscribe to 50 communities and recreate one, because of this someone made a tool to download your data off of lemmy and upload it to another instance https://github.com/CMahaff/lasim
Aside from what Coelacanth said, those instances are no more likely to shut down than lemmy.world (I can’t recall a Lemmy instance that’s not for personal use ever shutting down); they’ve functioned just fine for years and have even been upgraded for the surge of users too
That’s correct though account migration is planned for some point in the future, or at least noted as a desirable feature by the Devs. Maybe even linking accounts across instances?
Having to resubscribe to all your communities is annoying but I imagine third party apps could streamline that process when they get released/refined.
Removed by mod
I started on lemmy.ml but it was unusable for the past few days. Today I managed to get into programming.dev pretty quickly and it has been smooth sailing.
My instance (civilloquy.com) has open sign-ups. ;)
When I applied, I never got a notification that it got approved, but I could post and comment on that instance. So you might have been in a similar situation as me or the admins are still dealing with a large influx of people
Oh wow you’re totally right. I was just able to log into one that I had never heard from! Thank you, good call!
What does it mean to say that Lemmy is federated?
Basically there are many different Lemmy servers. Http://lemmy.world Http://lemmy.ml Http://shit.just.works Etc etc
It doesn’t matter which one you sign up for. Most of them talk to one another. For example. Lemmy.ml people can subscribe to and read Lemmy.world communities.
Lemmy can also talk to other “fediverse” social media platforms like Kbin. You often see a lot of Kbin users in Lemmy comments.
I’m still wrapping my head around things so someone please correct me if I’ve got the wrong idea. But here’s how i see it:
It’s kinda similar to the “United States” being a large group of individual self contained entities (states/servers) with their own rules and resources while all being interconnected. You can live in New York (join lemmy.ml) and be fully part of the US (lemmy as a whole) and are totally free to travel to California (lemmy.world) in a car/airplane (whatever frontend/app you prefer) and hang out and participate there.
Instances can also decide to exclude themselves/other instances if they don’t agree with the rest of the group (Texas wanting to secede, the US wanting to chop off Florida into the gulf of mexico… sorry FL, only kidding, we love you)
If you feel like New York is too crowded, too much traffic on the roads, you can choose to live in Maine (a smaller less populated instance) instead and still be part of the group.
You can even dump a bunch of soil into the ocean and create your own state (hosting your own server) that can participate with the others, or choose to isolate yourself from the world and only allow participation on your island (North Korea?)
Apologies for the america-centric reply but it’s where i live and what I’m familiar with.
Unless it defederates like beehaw keeps doing.
What’s going on with beehaw? I’m a bit out of the loop.
Basically, due to the size and open registrations on some large instances, Beehaw admins decided to defederate because they didn’t have the manpower or systems in place to deal with the large volume of content.
I think I read that they have 4 people running everything and 2 aren’t techy.
All in all, they have some of the biggest communities for gay folks, Trans folks, and other minority groups. Lots of trolls from large open instances were shit posting lots of hateful crap in those communities.
The Lemmy’s mod tools are still kind of janky and they couldn’t keep pace with the toxic trolling, so they made the call to defederate from instances like Lemmy.world temporarily, until some new mod tools get built.
All the admins from the defederated instances get it and they all appear to be on the same page.
That said, users got pissed because beehaw has one of the best tech communities. So now people on Lemmy.world don’t have their posts / comments show up in those communities.
Basically, they had two shitty options, and they went with protecting the vulnerable minority.
It’s temporary.
Beehaw is a community that wants to create a specific type of experience for its users, it wants to create a safer space and has stricter rules.
I think it’s personally a non-issue that people get riled up about. They’ve temporarily defederated from lemmy.world because of the large spikes in new users and wanting to have the moderation tools necessary to handle that while keeping their community the way they want it.
There is a subset of new Lemmy users who think this experience needs to be Reddit 2.0, that it needs to be perfect and totally smooth for new users, or else it will fail?
Personally, I don’t agree. I don’t want Lemmy to be Reddit at all. In the last month, I’ve found that I didn’t realize just how bad my Reddit experience had become. I’m okay with the experience being a little rough around the edges here and adjusting together. It has become obvious based on how good my interactions were here. How solid and interesting the content was. I’m not fiending for my specific subreddits, I’m good to move on and find new areas to focus on the internet.
I have a separate account for Beehaw, all the iOS apps already have way way better functionality than the Reddit official app, I can seamlessly switch between accounts. It’s been absolutely amazing to see how much this site and experience has evolved in one month. I’m super excited for the future here.
One thing I don’t miss is the “culture”… I hope this shift into the fediverse frees comment sections of the endless same dumb low effort puns, and even worse puns in the replies. Or fucking award speeches in comment edits, the same shitty jokes that nobody likes but somehow still perpetuate…
I really look forward to something new
I’m late to the conversation. Yeah, that’s what I hated about Reddit. I’ve been using it since 2009, and I noticed that it got progressively worse the moment they introduced karma.
I like the rough around the edges. Little tricks and nuances I’ve picked up. Makes it fun.
Beehaw defederated from other instances as users were getting around bans by creating new accounts on those instances. The admins in question are talking about how to address this.
They are overly sensitive special snowflakes that pipi their pampers if anybody that doesn’t have 100% the same opinions as them is allowed to use the internet
Motives aside, the point is one account won’t always get you everywhere. Doing a little research before picking a home instance can’t hurt.
That’s where join-lemmy really missed out. They should have introduced a set of rules like join-mastodon where instances must have at least two admins, a clear code of conduct, and clear rules as to how they manage closedown. That way users would be reasonably safe in picking an instance at random. But they didn’t so everyone should go to safe choices like lemmy.world.
The problem is that it uses WebSockets in a completely braindead way. There is absolutely zero reason to waste server resources on that for every single user. Of course it fails to scale…
Well you’re in luck because Lemmy 0.18 rips out all WebSocket code.
So signup for a smaller instance
Unless you want to create a community on that instance. You can only create communities in the instance you sign up.
…so create your community on that instance. Others will still be able to access it just like you’re accessing communities elsewhere.
Some instances disallow community creation. That’s the only part where this argument has any merit. Otherwise which instance a community is on doesn’t really matter.
You gotta use lemmy.world for the OG experience 😂
Are all of the lemmy servers different? I just signed up on lemmy.world
Well, they are different server with different versions of lemmy running. But I think lemmy.world is running great again
I’m worried about the search function. Every post ever made?
I want to be mad but FFS Reddit had Conde Nast money for most of its shittery so they had NO excuse except incompetence.
At least Fediverse servers are typically Steve’s old laptop or some shit so it’s understandable.
It’s generally more like “Steve’s 10 eur/mo cloud server in which they run ten other things next to Lemmy, which is written by two devs and barely held together by duct tape and prayers”
But that doesn’t change the overall point.
But I know where OC was coming from, 15-25 years ago it would have been the crap old laptop, the cardboard box server, the DEC PDP-11 the University is still powering for some reason.
… the PDP-11 😂
Good point. Who the hell hosts their own server anymore?
Honestly, it’s negligent if a major company does host their own servers at this point. Big cloud server companies specialize in that and can do it better than others, with better guarantees of stability and maintenance. Pretty much the reason people specialize in everything else.
What you’re saying here is literally a punchline in infosec because of how many breaches are down to incompetent cloud service providers, because said cloud service providers take security about as seriously as the aforementioned c-suite does.
*EDIT No, the c-suite thing doesn’t make sense. Shut up. I recast this post and removed a bit. I don’t need your approval. I DRIVE A DODGE STRATUS
Lol what? Every server has down time. But the big cloud companies have actual liability for theirs
You are entirely ignorant of how anything works. There’s no “liability” unless they seriously fuck a goat. Downtime is expected and, in fact, built into contracts. X amount of downtime for service, Y amount for unforeseen circumstances, Z amount for shiggles. There may be some prorating built into it, but even that will be after a certain amount of downtime.
No matter how you slice it the only reason anyone uses cloud services is to cut costs. There actual facts simply do not pan out when you’re talking about security.
No matter how you slice it the only reason anyone uses cloud services is to cut costs.
Businesses chose cloud providers because they think that it will cut costs.
Those contracts are exactly what I mean. A certain, small amount of downtime is allowed for, and it’s expected to be fixed shortly. If either of those things aren’t true, then the business is in breach of that agreement.
Anyway no u r ignorant. Peace out
it’s that cheap? If I spun up an instance and paid less than $150 how many users would I be able to have before it implodes?
Only one way to find out ;)
On a more serious note… I’m not sure if much has changed since then (probably, things have been moving fast…), but lemmy.world was hosted on about a $150 / mo server:
https://blog.mastodon.world/ https://www.hetzner.com/dedicated-rootserver/matrix-ax (it’s the most expensive option here)
That’s pretty beefy. You could probably get away with much less for a smaller instance.
But…but…spez said it will cause 200k per month!
To be fair, Reddit is a lot bigger than any Lemmy instance, and Lemmy instances have the benefit of being decentralised, so the load is on many different servers owned by different people as opposed to one group of servers owned by one company.
That’s because he wants all 55 million active users accessing his servers so he shove ads down their throats.
The instance I’m replying from is a 5 eur/mo box from Hetzner.
Your main concerns are gonna be active user count & storage space. Especially if you decide to allow image or god forbid video uploads. Having a bunch of inactive users aren’t going to affect costs that much as long as they don’t have, like, a milion subscriptions. (If they’re all subscribed to the same community things will “deduplicate”)
Do you have any specific resources or suggestions? I’m a software dev with lots of DigitalOcean experience looking to host my own instance. Also, can you log in to wefwef through your instance, or how do you access everything, specifically on mobile?
Depending on how well you know your way around, my recommendation is to not use the Ansible setup but instead treat it as documentation while doing things your way. It has quite a bit of strange stuff going on (postfix? two nginx installs with only one being in a container?) and seems to be missing important things such as SSH hardening. It also assumes it’ll be the only thing running in your server just in general (horrible yet common practice, unfortunately) so if you have anything set up it may or may not clobber over it to do things it’s own way, and end up breaking something.
Also, can you log in to wefwef through your instance, or how do you access everything, specifically on mobile?
I haven’t tried wefwef in particular but all native apps I tried work just fine. An issue I can see cropping up from wefwef is that Lemmy’s CORS policies are way too restrictive by default. No idea if they do any kind of proxying to get around that but that would be the main issue I’d imagine.
What’s the learning curve like? That honestly seems like a much bigger hurdle than cost.
There are many guides on getting started with Linux servers as a whole. I recommend installing Debian Bookworm on a virtual machine or a spare laptop at first and going through the writeups all major cloud providers have, just to get a feel for using the terminal & initial setup (SSH hardening and reverse proxy configuration and so on)
After getting an initial feel for Linux admining, start reading up on Docker, Docker Compose, and containers in general. Avoid Podman until you’re experienced with Docker as it’s just different enough to trip you up. You can also check out LXC/LXD although it’s way less popular.
Oh, and speaking of Docker: UFW AND DOCKER WILL NOT WORK TOGETHER! DOCKER BYPASSES UFW (just making sure you don’t learn this until it’s too late)
Be careful of guides that are old (even a year makes a difference) or for different “distros” than the one you have. An exception for the second case is the Arch Linux wiki, which is one of the best resources just in general, aside from a few Arch specific bits like the exact package names to install. You should also use Arch’s “man pages” reference, as they’re built from the latest versions of packages compared to other man page renderers that are frequently outdated (like die.net)
Lemmy itself is harder to get right because the instructions so far are intended for people who kinda know what they’re doing, but once you have the base Linux admin knowledge, it won’t be that hard to pick up the parts necessary to get working with something like Lemmy.
it’s that cheap? If I spun up an instance and paid less than $150 how many users would I be able to have before it implodes?
About tree fiddy
Reddit’s database was pretty poorly designed. They designed it to be really flexible so they could make changes easily early on, but it was highly inefficient. I don’t know if it’s still like that, but the old website’s source code is public and it is very inefficient.
Like the good old times
It’s great to be here. All part of the fun of being apart of something new.
I feel much as I did 12 years ago when I created my reddit account. I feel the winds of change in my bones.
It’s early days here. Give it some time…
It’s part of the charm :D
Agreed! Lemmy kinda captures the same sense of excitement and experimentation that the early internet seemed to have.
Ngl. I am having fun.
It is nice honestly. I appreciate all of you that have joined. This is going to be fun!
Not sure if this is meant to be negative or positive but I for one like all the growing pains and issues. It makes the whole experience a little more engaging for me. I really like reading up on what problems are happening and how the teams are working towards solutions. I especially like the technical details that are just a little over my head because it’s fun to learn about!
This is definitely a sink-or-swim moment for Lemmy. If this is going to work, this is the chance. Twitter and Reddit are imploding. Users have a reason to try something new and are willing to deal with young, buggy platforms because it’s better than the alternative and they needed an Internet home. My upvote taking ten seconds to register is itself the knife’s edge of creation, a new birth.
Would upvote but I keep getting server-side errors
That’s interesting but have you considered that Value <html> of type java.lang.String cannot be converted to JSONObject?
Does the Narwhal bacon again?
Oh god
Only at midnight.
You are my first upvote and this is my first comment
Hopefully this turns into something
And here I am laughing on my speedy private instance. For real, the best part of Lemmy is if your experience is bad you can hop to a different instance and not miss a post
Question about this, is it just a speedier general browsing on other instances as well? Or just your local posts?
Everything is faster. For the most part, your local instance will download posts and comments for any community you (or anyone else on your instance) is subscribed to. So when you log in, you log into your server and browse the content locally (posts from everywhere) while your server in the background constantly is receiving updates through the ActivityPub protocol.
I literally have no delay in using Lemmy in any way.
What about the “all” stream? Is that also preloaded to the server?
The “all” stream would be all of the posts from the combined subs of the users on the instance. So if there’s a community nobody is subscribed to, it won’t appear on all. This is true of all instances. Many smaller ones will employ bots to crawl Lemmy and sub to communities to give the large instance “all” feeling.
That being said, yeah it’s all preloaded onto your local server. There is no difference in speed. Doesn’t matter if it’s active/subed or new/all they all load the same
I’d highly encourage everyone to find smaller instances and leave lemmy.world for the immediate expats. Find something that aligns with your values. Or if you are technically literate enough host your own instance. If you have an old desktop computer you’ve already got everything you need.
I do that on my own instance too :D, private and small instances are really the way to go!
How many communities you subscribed and after two weeks how much data does it represents on your storage ?
Not OP but I can answer with my own stats:
In just a week, With BTRFS compression (compress-force=zstd:3) & deduplication (via bees), media is at about 1GB (and I am subscribed to media-heavy communities like 196) and the postgres DB is at about 550MB (which is also currently shared with Matrix Dendrite)
At “idle” (as you can be while being connected to ActivityPub & Matrix), the immediate CPU and RAM usage breakdown per container is:
NAME CPU % MEM USAGE / LIMIT MEM % NET IO BLOCK IO PIDS CPU TIME AVG CPU % pict-rs 0.20% 18.92MB / 4.005GB 0.47% 3.319GB / 1.105GB 17.58GB / 3.239GB 13 1h16m57.232828s 0.59% crowdsec 1.39% 44.23MB / 4.005GB 1.10% 106.4MB / 23.46MB 25.53GB / 486.7MB 11 45m28.744419s 1.95% caddy 0.63% 73.06MB / 4.005GB 1.82% 1.675GB / 1.977GB 3.322GB / 720MB 10 21m9.94572s 0.90% dendrite 1.58% 197.7MB / 4.005GB 4.94% 912.8MB / 2.33GB 8.718GB / 4.761GB 12 53m26.302022s 1.43% postgres 5.33% 82.51MB / 4.005GB 2.06% 56.22GB / 7.961GB 20.92GB / 295.7GB 23 8h20m28.078567s 2.86% lemmy-ui 0.00% 48.71MB / 4.005GB 1.22% 3.491GB / 5.961GB 3.603GB / 5.267GB 12 31m35.884936s 0.24% lemmy-be 2.82% 29.01MB / 4.005GB 0.72% 16.45GB / 57.85GB 7.966GB / 6.439GB 6 3h6m34.633508s 1.42%Net IO you shouldn’t really care about as that includes inter-container networking. I’m trying to find how much outgoing data have been transferred but because the month just ended I have no idea how accurate the numbers are.
On my instance we’ve got about 100 communities subscribed to. Started it first week of June, since then the instance is up to a little over 4 GB of disk space. YMMV depending on instance size.
For those of you who, like me, are coming from Apollo you guys can try wefwef.app. It’s great
It’s a nice app, but I’m really wondering who came up with that name and why. That’s not how you name something if you want it to be successful.
Perhaps they’re not trying to “be successful”?
It’s getting a name change.
I would hope so lol
I know this night sound like a dumb comment, but it’s kind of worth thinking about.
Since it isn’t an iOS app, they could probably make a version of it which isn’t so iOS inspired, because frankly that layout is confusing to anyone who isn’t used to it.
I know Apple have a way of doing things, and they’re like apps to look a certain way, but if you’re not used to it it’s not intuitive at all.
But the point of wefwef is to feel familiar to those who used and are missing Apollo, the most popular iOS app.
There has been a groundswell of Android apps starting up and not a great deal of activity in the iOS-specific space. So, wefwef is welcome for those looking for something that ticks that box.
I just put a webpage link to my Lemmy homepage on my Home Screen. I haven’t found the ability to comment or anything though, and I’m signed in.
Edit- apparently I was signed out. 🤣
Waiting for sync
I keep getting “cant load sever data” with this app. Is this just a lemmy thing or an app thing.
In one of the posts a couple days ago the developer of wefef stated that the app is getting rate limited by lemmy.world servers because so many people are using it. I think they were trying to resolve it but I am still getting the same issue occasionally. It’s just growing pains of the whole ecosystem & totally expected and normal. I’m happy to be an early adopter of all this stuff and watching it grow and mature will be an exciting adventure!
The instances are volunteer-ran and make no profit, give them some time to iron everything out
